Thursday, October 2, 2008

Tonights The Night

Tonight is the VP debate and I will watch. I admit to not getting as involved as I should.Both candidates have serious communication issues so this should be really entertaining. I can't wait to see all the reviews tomorrow. Let the politikin begin!

10 comments:

Doug said...

Actually I think that Sarah Palin will acquit herself quite well in a debate setting. It is in the totally unscripted environment where she struggles. Joe Biden is just as likely to stick his foot in his mouth as anybody.
You do have to find humor though when Sarah Palin is asked a question to which the answer is she has no earthly clue. Um...well...I um....they just don't like Joe six pack and well I uh.
Okay I'll stop now. You're right Matt, should be interesting. I will actually stop watching the football game tonight to tune in.

Joanna said...

It's not here yet.Yet,Mat,Obama stands for revisiting taxes to companies that send jobs overseas.NAFTA.He's wanting to wean our country from being soooo reliant on overseas oil.He wants the middle class to not be touched,$250 K and over may feel a twinge from taxes.He wants to pullout slowly from Iraq.Osama's in Afghanistan anyways and 80 other countries as well have his sentiment toward Americans.I know,I read it out here.And McCain's been in office for more than half my life...shouldn't he have achieved some sort of intellectual epiphany?

Sean said...

Obama stands for revisiting taxes to companies that send jobs overseas.NAFTA.

? What does this really mean? Why do companies send jobs overseas? Is it because management *likes* to fire US workers? No. Work goes overseas precisely because tax rates are higher in the US, because benefits are higher in the US. How does raising taxes even more do anything to improve this? I work for a European company (Philips). They have even higher tax rates, benefits costs and involvment of "unions" (though they call them labor boards) than we do here. So, they are more more in line with what Obama is advocating. I can assure you that we aren't loosing American jobs to Holland, though. European jobs are also being outsourced to India, China, etc. So, ask Obama why this is better for us to become more like Europe?

He's wanting to wean our country from being soooo reliant on overseas oil.

? What does this actually mean? Is he in favor of taking advantage of our domestics supplies of oil and natural gas? Is he in favor of building more refineries? Is he in favor of building nuclear power plants? NO? then how, exactly, does he propose to wean us of foreign oil?

He wants the middle class to not be touched,$250 K and over may feel a twinge from taxes.

? What kind of society (or even species) would thrive on supporting the many on the backs of the few? Why do people in the "lower class" make what they make? It is because that's all they have to make. They don't demand to make more from their employers because they don't have the tax burden that those "rich people" > 250K have, because we have government entitlements that take from the "rich" and give to the poor. Companies can't pay whatever they pay for labor - they have to compete for this with other companies. Tax payers are essentially subsidizing the lower end labor costs through entitlement programs. Wouldn't we all be better off without the middle man? This would force companies to pay true labor rates, employees would make more, tax payers would pay less and we'd eliminate the inherent overhead of funneling this through government.

He wants to pullout slowly from Iraq.

? who doesn't want to pullout from Iraq? But, look elsewhere. We still have troops in Japan and Germany. Why isn't anyone screaming about this? What we *really want* is to stop loosing troops in Iraq. This will come. (it would come a lot sooner if we'd start showing resolve and one front on this).

mat said...

Damn Sean that brought tears to my eyes. How did we all get so smart?
Thanks for articulating that so well. Yea he's an elitist, some people have no clue about what his proposals really mean for working people. The more taxes EVIL companies have to pay, the less people they will higher. And yea what about all the troops on Guam maybe we should pull them out too.
Like I said, vote for your candidate and live with the consequences.

Doug said...

This elitist label that's been pinned on Obama by some, how exactly is that a bad thing? I always thought that elite meant pretty good. You know like Elite Fighting Corps, or Elite Escort Service.
I think it's safe to say that whichever candidate ends up in the White House will be severely constrained by the grim realities of the current credit and financial markets. There simply will not be sufficient resources to implement some of the pie in the sky entitlements that are being proposed.
I do truly believe however that for a country with our wealth and where with all to have 40 million plus working people with no health care is morally indefensible.

Sean said...

Saying 40 million people have not healthcare if not the same as 40 million people want healthcare and can't get it.

How many of us worried about healthcare when we were in our 20's? How many of us that had it actually used it. I know that I didn't use it, but I still contributed to it.

I see a couple issues with healthcare in america:

1) The government prevents us from shopping around to get our own coverage. Why should health insurance be different from any other insurance? Anyone required to get their car insurance from their employer???

2) We tend to think of insurance benefits as something our employers 'give us'. We don't tax their part, we don't include it in our salary and as a result we don't think of its true value. As long as it is 'covered' on the plan, we're all for getting the prescriptions, going to the doctors, etc. Do we tend to consume healthcare 'cause its free - probably. We have a gross salary that we tend to think of as what it costs our employers to hire us - but what about the health insurance, 401K contributions, dental, vision, life insurance, etc. We call these the 'fully burdened' cost of an employee. We the workers don't see this, don't appreciate it and tend to think of these services as free entitlements. I'd rather get one lump sum and worry about my own insurance and retirement.

3) Why does healthcare 'cost so much'? An average family doctor has a 200K burden of insurance - something we all pay for.

4) Why do drugs 'cost so much'? it costs BILLIONS to bring a new drug to market. There are many years of studies and regulations to go through. This is what we demand from the FDA, and then we still revile "big pharmaceuticals'.

Keep the government out of it. I can't imagine they'll do anything to make it better or cheaper. Show me one area where government manages anything well.

Doug said...

How about...highway infrastructure, national defense, air traffic control, national parks, food and consumer product safety to name a few. The dogma that anything government can do private industry can do better in all cases has little validity. There are some things that are simply beyond the scope of what a profit motivated entity should be expected to reasonably and responsibly achieve.
I'm free to shop around for health care anywhere I'd like although it would seem silly to do so as I am currently covered under the umbrella of my company's group policy.
I have never considered my health insurance as anything that is given to me. It is an earned benefit with unquestioned monetary value. And my family coverage costs me plenty, not to mention co-pays and out of pocket minimums. Health insurance, 401K's etc are in the realm of employee benefits and are widely agreed upon as part of the cost of attracting and retaining competent workers. God help you if you lose your job though right?
R&D costs of prescription drugs can be quite high but the potential reward for the pharmaceutical companies can be exponentially higher. Product liability insurance is a huge cost associated with pharmaceuticals same as malpractice costs are driving doctors out of practice. Leaving this health care crisis for the industry to sort itself out makes about as much sense as leaving millions to figure out how they will pay for care when they get sick. You and I and anyone else that has health insurance are ALREADY paying for the uncovered in costs passed on to us by caregivers and their supporting infrastructure in uncovered care.
I don't think it's realistic for us to think that we'll all have the same coverage that Obama and his fellow senators enjoy but there is no reason, none whatever that a nation with our ability and resources would leave a number of its citizens with lees heath care coverage than that afforded your average convicted & incarcerated felon.

mat said...

Yep, The politikin has begun. Let the games begin. I also pay plenty for my health care but I still don't know why thats a bad thing. A lot (whole lot) of people have health insurance offered to them but don't take it because they say they can't afford it but then when the get a catastrophic health issue like cancer they can't afford to get treatment. My son in law has a decent job as a plumber/welder and he doesn't take advantage of his employers plan because he can't afford it. But he always has a 30 pack of beer in the frig for when friends come over. The grandkids all get medicaid so WTF. If he gets sick he goes to the emergency room. My son goes to the emergency room all the time but then never pays the bill. I do with higher premiums. I think the problem is with so many people thinking that theyr'e entitled to shit. Yes as a civilized society we have a vested interest in making sure we are healthy. BUT those that can pay SHOULD pay. I could use another 300 plus bucks on my check every month but I know as sonn as I cancel my insurance I'll get sick. This whole no insurance thing is way overblown. There are already plans in place for the low income and there are public health centers in almost every city that offers innoculations and preventive medical care for children. And don't forget you can still go to the emergency room if you get sick. Yea you'll have to pay but the alternative is maybe not living.

Doug said...

Matt,
you started it. I'm going to take a drink tonight every time there's a reference to lipstick.

Sean said...

If everyone needs health insurance then it is like food/water/shelter. The govt should stop paying for it (by that I mean taking from some to pay for others). When that happens everyone (even those on the 'bottom') will have to earn a wage that will cover their healthcare. They will demand higher wages and get it because companies have to compete for people in a free market.

Before you know it, the cost of health care goes down because 1) there is competition and 2) the government is not in the middle (by that I mean skimming a significant amount from the total healthcare spend).

Yes, there should be no reason anyone in America can't get healthcare. But the mechanism must be free markets and self reliance, not a Robin Hood government.